___________________________________________________________________________ | From : KeelyNet BBS | DataLine : (214) 324-3501 | | Sysop : Jerry W. Decker | Voice : (214) 324-8741 | | Co-Sysop : Ronald Barker | Voice : (214) 242-9346 | | File Name : FF.ASC | Online Date : 05/22/94 | | Contributed by : Bert Pool | Dir Category : ENERGY | | KeelyNet * PO BOX 1031 * Mesquite, Texas * USA * 75149 | --------------------------------------------------------------------------- The following is a compilation of messages regarding electrical energy, the TOD circuit, Bert Pool's FIREFLY circuit and other related material. The file continues as FF1.ASC, etc. as the messages grow. =========================================================================== Message 4141 DATE/TIME: 01/08/94 19:53 From : BERT POOL -- RECEIVED -- To : BILL BEATY Subject: (R) Time Dialation Experiments Folder : A, "Public Mail" Bill, your suggestion for using two heterodyning oscillators is a good one. I may work on just such a device soon. Right now, I am preparing to prove to myself that electric current actually flows from negative to positive in an electric circuit, and also to measure the actual speed of propagation of this current through a copper conductor. I will use a conductor 10,000 feet long to perform this measurement. Question: If you take a 10,000 ft. long conductor and place an LED at a position 3,000 ft down the negative lead, one at 5,000 ft. and a third at 7,500 ft., and connect a battery will: (a) the LEDS will light sequentially, negative to positive (b) the LEDS will light simultaneously (c) the LEDS will light sequentially, positive to negative? The LED's, by the way, are in SERIES so that current has to flow through all three to return to the battery. The real interesting part of the experiment will follow this measurement. I calculate that a pulse cannot take less than 10.17 microseconds to travel the 10,000 ft. path, negative to positive on the battery. If I connect the battery to the wire for 1 microsecond then disconnect it (i.e., a very short pulse), will the LED light up for 1 microsecond? Think carefully! Because by the time the pulse gets to the LED, the battery is NO LONGER CONNECTED to the battery. If the battery is not connected to the wire, how can current flow through the LED? I'm interested in what your guess is on all this, and anyone else's ideas are welcome as well. =========================================================================== Message 4164 DATE/TIME: 01/09/94 16:30 From : BILL BEATY -- RECEIVED -- To : BERT POOL Subject: (R) Time Dialation Experiments Folder : A, "Public Mail" Re: Speed of electricity. I must apologize for being longwinded in the following, but you've got me started! . When I had to design a museum exhibit on electricitiy physics, I had to re- teach myself how electricity really works, having been mis-educated by misconception-ridden american textbooks. It turns out batteries and Page 1 generators do not supply electricity, they merely pump it. All wires, in fact all metals, are already full of electricity. You may recall from some science class that metals contain a "sea of electrons." This "sea" is what moves when electric current exists in a wire. This fact is of prime importance when one is thinking about what goes on in circuits. Also, electron flows happen very very slowly, on the order of inches per hour depending on the current. In an AC system, the electrons sit in place and wiggle, and do not flow forward at all. So, it's not the ELECTRICITY which travels fast within wires, it's the WAVES of starting and stopping that move fast, it's the energy which moves fast. Electrical energy flows and electrical signals are longitudinal waves of electron compression and rarefaction supported by electrostatic repulsion between masses of electrons confined within a wire. . Now on to your experiment: If you suddenly connect BOTH leads of a battery to a very long circle of wire hanging in air, the battery will pull electrons into its positive terminal while it also pushes electrons out its negative one. This sends a speed-of-light wave out both terminals of the battery. The wave is a compression wave on the negative terminal, and a rarefaction wave on the positive. As these waves get to successive LEDs in the circuit, they will be lit sequentially. I predict that the 7500-ft LED will light first (it's only 2500ft. from the end), followed by the 3000-ft LED, followed by the 5000ft one. . What happens if you remove the battery before the wave gets to the LEDs? I predict that removing the battery will send a second wave of ceasing-of- motion out thru the wire, and the LEDs will darken in the same sequence in which they were lit. Connecting the battery for 1.0 uSec will send a 1.0 uSec pulse to the LEDs. I'm envisioning an acoustic analogy here. If you shout down a very long hose, then suddenly remove your mouth, the sound that's already in the hose will keep going to the end whether your mouth is there or not. . One thing to think about: if you do the experiment on a wire spool rather than on an immense circle of wire, I don't think the waves of compression\ rarefaction will stay on one wire and spiral their way through the entire length of the coil. Instead, voltage and current in one wire will inductively and capacatively couple to adjacent wires, and so your signal wavefronts will skip across the coil and act as if they are moving much faster than the speed of light. Each turn of the coil acts like a trans- former winding for all the other turns. You either have to spread your wire out in a big field, or use coax cable so adjacent turns are shielded. Also, are you going to switch BOTH battery connections on and off? If you connect the two terminals to the wire at two different times, your results would be different. . Have you heard about the experiments done in 1902 or so which showed that the mobile electricity within copper is electrons. Researchers wound a big spool of wire on a wheel, connected the ends to a meter through sliprings, spun the wheel a high speeds, then stopped it suddenly. Page 2 The sudden halt in the wire's motion did not jerk the electricity to as sudden a stop, and a pulse of current was measured in the meter. It was a negative current in the direction of the wire's motion. I don't know if they tried this on many different metals. It is vaguely remenicent of Searle's original attempt to make a generator by throwing electrons off the edge of a spinning disk. . I must point out that all of the above is based upon my knowledge of conventional circuit physics. It's never occurred to me to try doing experiments like these. I'd love to hear what happens. You're aware that Joe Newman's motor designs are based upon pulses racing around in coils? It's work like yours which has a chance of showing up anomolies and opening the door to really interesting lines of research. =========================================================================== Message 4174 DATE/TIME: 01/10/94 11:14 From : BERT POOL -- RECEIVED -- To : BILL BEATY Subject: Direction and speed of electrical curren Folder : A, "Public Mail" Bill, I really appreciate your feedback on the experiment on transmitting pulses through wire. Discussion like this helps generate new ideas and experiments. Your discussion definitely adds new questions. . On your comment that a battery sends a compression wave OUT the negative terminal and a rarefacation wave OUT the positive, at the speed of light: If we place an LED twice as close to the positive terminal as the negative; lets say this is 6000 ft from negative, 3000 ft from positive, and connect both terminals of the battery to the wire, which wave will reach the LED first, the compression or the rarefaction? Since BOTH waves are traveling at 'c', it is obvious that the rarefaction wave from the positive pole will "pull" electrons through the LED long before the compression wave can "push" them through. . The LED should be lit by the rarefaction wave several microseconds before the compression wave gets there. In fact, using this analogy, the LED should light up TWICE - once when the rarefaction wave "pulls" electrons through the LED and a second time when the compression wave "pushes" more electrons through the LED. Normally these two events would be so close together that the phenomenon would never be seen - unless you were looking for it! (and believe me, I intend to look!). . Using your water hose analogy, if we take a long garden hose and at the 2/3 length position place a "paddle" wheel to indicate air movement and have one person blow on the long end (compression) and another suck on the short end of the hose (rarefaction), the paddle wheel should move twice. The rarefaction wave will reach the paddle wheel first, moving it, and logically, a short time later the compression wave will move the wheel again. . That is, of course, unless the rarefaction wave, upon passing the paddle wheel, reaches the compression wave at the MIDDLE of the hose, and cancels it. (Both waves are traveling at the same speed and so should meet at the middle point of the hose. Compression and rarefaction waves DO cancel, yes?). Since the paddle wheel was moved by the rarefaction wave long before the compression wave could ever have arrived, the short length of time measured for the wheel to move could be wrongly (?) interpreted as showing that electric current travels from positive to negative. . Page 3 This scenario suggests that if we take two 5000 ft conductors and place an LED at the far end (middle), and place another two LEDs, one at each of the 2500 ft marks and connect a battery, a compression wave will travel from the negative pole of the battery toward the LED on the negative wire while a rarefaction wave travels from the positive pole of the battery toward the LED on the positive wire. Since both waves are traveling at the same speed, both of these LEDs should light up AT THE SAME TIME, the negative LED when the compression wave pushes electrons through it, and the positive LED when the rarefaction wave pulls electrons through it! And a short time later BOTH waves will reach the middle LED and light it up last. . So, looking at the gargen hose and wire and using your classical theory, I'm still not sure what will REALLY happen. We can put forth at least two or three conflicting lighting hypothesis based on the same theory. . Will the LED's pulse only once or will they pulse twice? Will there be a sequential lighting, and if so, in what order? Or might some of the LEDs light simultaneously? I had no idea at the outset that such a simple experiment could be SO MUCH FUN! I am prepared to do this experiment tomorrow, but I'm not about to actually do it until I get more pre-experiment guesses from you and the other Keely Netters. I'd have never thought about a rarefaction wave lighting up an LED before a compression wave getting there - thanks. . By the way Bill, you are certainly invited to participate in performing this experiment (hope you are local!). . The wire will not be on a spool when the experiment is conducted - self inductance and capacitance would skew the measurements. I plan on doing this out in the country in some deserted field where I can unreel 10,000 feet of wire into large loops with as little self capacitance and inductance as possible. . Anyone got a farm field with nearby power that we can use? (no Norm, we don't want to do this experiment in the Arkansas outback!) . Please re-read all our messages on this, ruminate a while, and get back with me later. >> Bert . p.s. - anyone else out there got any feedback on this simple experiment? It may be simple, but there are some very important electric foundation pillars being pushed and pulled around here! . p.p.s. Jerry, this discussion is starting to look like "file" material, yes? cc: Norman Wootan =========================================================================== Message 4187 DATE/TIME: 01/10/94 16:52 From : BERT POOL -- RECEIVED -- To : BILL BEATY Subject: Cease-of-motion wave??? Folder : A, "Public Mail" Bill, I re-read your comments: . BB > What happens if you remove the battery before the BB > wave gets to the LEDs? Page 4 BB > I predict that removing the battery will send a second BB > wave of ceasing-of-motion out thru the wire, and the LEDs BB > will darken in the same sequence in which they were lit. BB > Connecting the battery for 1.0 uSec will send a 1.0 uSec BB > pulse to the LEDs. I'm envisioning an acoustic analogy BB > here. If you shout down a very long hose, then suddenly BB > remove your mouth, the sound that's already in the hose BB > will keep going to the end whether your mouth is there or not. . Bill, what in the heck is a "ceasing-of-motion" wave? I know this is the "New Age", so maybe this is a Wave of the New Age? |:) . I was able to hang in there with you except for this. Maybe a clarification? >> Bert =========================================================================== Message 4226 DATE/TIME: 01/12/94 10:27 From : BILL BEATY -- RECEIVED -- To : BERT POOL Subject: (R) Direction and speed of electrical cu Folder : A, "Public Mail" Sounds like your analogy with the hose and paddle wheels is just about what I am visualizing for the workings of your experiment. One detail: . > That is, of course, unless the rarefaction wave, upon passing > the paddle wheel, reaches the compression wave at the MIDDLE of > the hose, and cancels it. (Both waves are traveling at the same > speed and so should meet at the middle point of the hose. > Compression and rarefaction waves DO cancel, yes?). . On the above, I would say that the compression and rarefaction waves would meet and cancel MOMENTARILY, but would then continue moving and go through each other and continue unaffected. I've seen this happen with water ripples. I've even made it happen myself when playing with pulses on hanging ropes and swinging chains. It's only when the medium is "nonlinear" that one wave can alter the path of another wave's energy. In linear media, waves go through each other and come out unaffected. . Oh, here's another thing I though of. The resistance of a power supply is very low, so you treat it as a conductor. So, if you should connect the battery to the long loop of wire AND LEAVE IT CONNECTED, the waves of compression and rarefaction should go all the way around the loop, return, and PASS THROUGH THE BATTERY and go around again. The LEDs should change brightness many times in a resonant exponential decay, as smaller and smaller positive and negative current waves go past them. The current waves would continue forever, but I think the resistance of the LEDs and of the wire will make them die off after a few trips. If the wire resistance is high enough, the waves might even be smeared out after a single trip. Something to watch out for. . And even if you disconnect the battery a microsecond after sending the pulses, you will still get multiple pulses at the LEDs because the missing battery acts as a mismatched impedance on your line, which causes total reflection of any waves hitting the end of the wire. The waves will return to the battery, find it missing, and so reverse course and make trips around the loop again backwards. . Wasn't there some free-energy invention which used very long lengths of Page 5 wire lying on the ground? I think it was powered by a tesla coil, but even so, you might get some weird results if your experiment interacts in any way with telluric currents, AC or DC. You might discover something interesting. Wouldn't it be great if you could accidentally tap a few kilowatts from the ether and blow up your LEDs? Or you might discover that you have to invest in 10000 feet of coaxial cable to get rid of earth current signals. . Also, I wonder if Bearden's "Final Secret" stuff involves some instantaneous propagation effects, followed by normal light speed effects. The thing where he connects a voltage to an inductor and then removes it before current starts, doesn't quite make sense if the starting of the current propagates as a lightspeed wave. Connecting a battery to an inductor, for even a brief moment, should in theory send a pulse down the wire of the coil. But if instead there was some INSTANTANEOUS wave (of electrogravity?) which filled the whole wire, it might alter the wire and make it suck ZPE. If this happens, you should see some waves on your wire which go much faster than the speed of light. Something to watch for! . I wonder what happens when you first connect one battery terminal to the wire loop, THEN connect the other one? The wire will first be suddenly charged up to the voltage of the battery terminal. As this voltage wave passes each LED, if it is high enough, it might make the LED pulse very breifly. This would be weird: flashing the LEDs with only ONE battery terminal connected. I don't know if the other battery terminal has to be connected to earth for this to happen, since it is an electrostatic effect. You also might have to momentarily ground your long wire first, to make sure it's at 0 volts. . >By the way Bill, you are certainly invited to participate in >performing this experiment (hope you are local!). . Sorry, I'm not local, I'm Seattle, WA. We used to have a fringe science/UFO/Magik/etc. group here a couple of years ago, called "The Group," but it ran out of steam when the person volunteering his home for meetings moved out of travel range. There still is Dale Travous here with his 9 ft. multi 10-KW tesla coil, and Gary Hawkins, who's 30KV capacitor bank penny-blasting was featured in EXTRAORDINARY SCIENCES last month. =========================================================================== Message 4227 DATE/TIME: 01/12/94 10:29 From : BILL BEATY -- RECEIVED -- To : BERT POOL Subject: (R) Cease-of-motion wave??? Folder : A, "Public Mail" >Bill, what in the heck is a "ceasing-of-motion" wave? I know this >is the "New Age", so maybe this is a Wave of the New Age? |:) . Yes, Glasshoppah, when ceasing-of-motion wave propagate to the everpresent "now" of one's position on the worldline, one begins to smell and is in need of being discarded. . Sorry ;) . That "ceasing of motion" thing is something I started saying because, when explaining electricity to people, I found that most everyone uses the word "current" to describe what flows in wires, rather than calling it "electricity" or "charge" or electrons. Page 6 "Current" cannot flow if current IS a flow of something. In my older message I almost said that a wave of "current" was going down the wire, but because of the blurry meaning of the word, I instead tried to say it more accurately. When you connect a battery to a circuit and wait a while, the whole circuit ends up with flowing charge. How did that charge start flowing? Well, when the wires first touched together, a wave of "starting-of-motion" zipped all around the circuit, leaving constantly flowing electrons in its wake. Now, when you break a closed circuit, THE ELECTRONS STOP WHERE THEY ARE. And they do the "stopping" one after another in sequence. And so a wave of motionlessness, or a wave of zero current, or a wave of ceasing-of-motion of electrons, overtakes each one in the circuit at the speed of light, leaving a lot of motionless electrons at the end. In your experiment with the long wire, the compression and rarefaction waves aren't simply pulses of breif movement, because in front of the waves the electrons are stopped, and behind the waves the electrons are moving. The waves are leading edges of a spreading area of movement of charges. =========================================================================== Message 4287 DATE/TIME: 01/14/94 20:45 From : BILL BEATY To : ALL Subject: Audio phase conj. Folder : A, "Public Mail" I don't think it's that easy to build an acoustic phase-congugate mirror. Don't these devices always require some sort of time-reversal, also some way of recording a two-dimensional pattern? The simplest way I can think of doing an acoustic version is this: Put a few hundred tiny loudspeakers and microphones in a large grid pattern with one speaker adjacent to each mic. Wire the mics to the inputs of a supertaperecorder having several hundred channels. Now record some distant sounds. If you now play the tape back in reverse so the sound comes out of the speakers backwards and amplified, the waveforms and phases of the sounds coming from the speakers will be such that the grid of speakers will direct powerful beams of sound out to each original source. Even with many separate sound sources, the device will simultaneously send a beam to each one. . Here's another idea: line a harbor with numerous individual high-speed water level sensors, and also numerous wave generators (maybe piston-driven panels or something) Now make a splash at some particular place in the harbor, and record the waves received on shore. If you now play back the received signals into the wave generators, and play them in reverse, you create a time-reversed contracting ripple pattern that shrinks down into a splash. And with a little amplification and processing, you could direct huge splashs to any point in the harbor. I've always wanted to do this in a science museum duck pond, then let people handle the controls of the timereversed phasecongugate hydralic wave duck dunker! =========================================================================== Message 4294 DATE/TIME: 01/15/94 02:31 From : BILL BEATY -- RECEIVED -- To : WILLIAM ALLEN Subject: (R) artificial scm Folder : A, "Public Mail" On the "artificial superconductor" coil: . I came up with my device while wondering how to fake a superconductor Page 7 levitation effect for a museum exhibit. You probably know that a superconductor can levitate permanent magnets by excluding their fields via closed current loops on the surface of the material. What suddenly appeared in my brain was a picture of a matrix of electromagnet coils, each with a hall-effect magnetic field sensor in the center, and each driven by a power amplifier getting its signal from the sensor. This setup does nothing, since the sensors detect any field from the coils and force them to turn off. BUT, if a magnet approaches the matrix of coils, the sensors will turn on the coils just enough to force the field at the sensors to be zero. This is just what a superconductor plate does! And the coils do repel the magnet. Regardless of which pole of the magnet approaches the coil, the sensor sends a current which forces the coil and magnet to repel. . Building this device is easier than it sounds. First try making a single "repulsor" coil as shown below. You use a switching-type bipolar hall effect sensor, a PNP and an NPN power darlington transistor, and a coil taken from a solenoid. I used 1/4-20 bolts for the iron core of my coils. The coil was for a 12V solenoid, and I drove it with + and - 24Vdc supplies. I got the transistors from DIGI-KEY electronic mail order, and the SS41 from R&D Electronic surplus catalog. . +Power \ / +Power 22K \ / GND __________ / / SS41 | | \ |/ ZTX603 goes here | / | | | | \100K *----*---| | | / | | | CORE V Micro- | \ / | |\ | ================ Switch _|_ | |/ | __\| ================ SS41 | | | | | \ _ _ _ | |-----*---| | | / \ / \ / \ |___| | | | | || || | | |\ | | |_____\_/__\_/__\_/__ | __\| | | COIL | -Power \ | | (fm 24V Solnoid.) | | | | / | | | |/__ | | | |/ GND | | | | *---| ZTX705 | | | |\ -Power \ \ -Power . Get the circuit operating, place the SS41 Hall-Effect sensor against the end of the coil's iron core, then bring a bar magnet near the end of the core and see if it repels. If not, turn the SS41 over to reverse it's output polarity. Attach the SS41 to the core (I used cable ties and silicone) . This is one repulsor coil. It acts like a bar magnet which repels either end of another magnet! With five I managed to levitate a 3" alnico rod Page 8 magnet VERY wobbly and temporary. With two rows of six coils attached to iron strips, I made a slanted track which bar magnets would zip silently along. This circuit is too simple and has no adjustments, and it is underdamped, so levitated magnets tend to wobble. Copper damping plates (pennys) held near the levitated magnet can cure this, but it's a cludgey fix. I have yet to build a square panel and attempt to float a big magnet. . If you build any of the above, try connecting an audio amp to the DC power lines. Each repulsor circuit is an inheirant switching power supply, and the chorus of variable frequency whining sounds from the coils is pretty cool. . On capacitor discharge: leave messages for Gary Hawkins on this board. He is working with 30kV oil capacitors with discharge energies like a shotgun blast. Ask him about samples of the pennies and quarters he shrunk by compressing them with the field of an exploding coil. cc: Jerry Decker =========================================================================== Message 4311 DATE/TIME: 01/15/94 15:31 From : BILL BEATY -- RECEIVED -- To : JERRY DECKER (SYSOP) Subject: Keely motor Folder : A, "Public Mail" THROUGH THE CURTAIN by Viola Neal & Shafica Karagulia / DeVorss & Co, Marina del Ray, CA, (c)1983 . This is a book on particular dreams some people had in the early '60s, where in the dream the person attended some sort of class and had various things explained to them. . In the Technology part of the book, the "teachers" say many times that sound is extremely important to physics, psychic phenomena, and to the structure of the universe. Also, the following two paragraphs suddenly appear. No other mention of motors or of "K" appear anywhere else as far as I can see. . From p172: "Concentrating on a particular geometrical form first at his throat center, then at a point in the brain, made it possible to start the "K" motor. The motor itself required a certain type of construction which was no secret, but once he had started it by this method it continued to operate until he had shut it off, either by mechanical means or again by focusing on certain geometrical forms in his brain. "K" happened on this through experimentation. He knew it was dangerous to give it to people and never said how he did it." . From p180: "The secret of the "K" motor was a crystalline form that was used and no one knew. It was under everybody's nose, but no one felt a crystal had an effect on a motor. "K" found out that just by visualizing the geometrical form of the crystal, he could get the motor to start. But there were crystals in the mechanism of the motor. Simpler devices than "K's" motor could be made. A simple combination of magnets and crystals could give you all Page 9 the energy you need to run a house." . So, who could the mysterious "K" be??! =========================================================================== Message 4479 DATE/TIME: 01/22/94 11:47 From : NORMAN WOOTAN -- RECEIVED -- To : GERALD O'DOCHARTY Subject: Capacitor Discharges Folder : A, "Public Mail" Gerald: You are probably already aware of what I am going to say so don't take offense for it is meant for the folks out there who don't really understand WATTS, KILLOWATTS or KILOWATT/HOURS. Remember that Tesla said that a capacitor is an amazing device for it allowed us the flexibility to store high voltage energy and release it at any time interval that we deamed oppropriate for our application. Let's look at an example. I have a bank of Energy Storage Capacitors that came from Oak Ridge, DOE made by Sangamo Electric. They are 12"x 12" x 30" in size and weigh 200# each. They are rated at 3000 JOULES @ 60,000 volts. I have a bank of them numbering 60 each which gives a total capacity of 180,000 JOULES. Now if I discharge this bank in 1 second @60 KV it would yield a current of 3 amps. What we are all familiar with is the electric meter which is watt/hours so this bank of capacitors would yield 50watt/hours,but if I discharge it in 1 millisecond the yield would be 180 MEGAWATTS. Then if I were able to discharge it in 1 microsecond then the pulse would be 1.8 GIGAWATTS. The problem is in the fact that the whole bank would explode and devistate everthing arround it. We can't get conductors big enough to handle the currents associated with an instantaneous discharge of this magnitude. The bottom line of the discussion is that power is based on time and the capacitor allows us to compress a lot of power in a short time frame. Be careful and good luck. Norm =========================================================================== Message 4490 DATE/TIME: 01/23/94 01:25 From : WILLIAM ALLEN To : ALL Subject: COILBAK RESPONSE FROM CHAD PRYSON Folder : A, "Public Mail" I HAVE BEEN SENDING FILES AND WORKING WITH CHAD PRYSON. WE WORKED TOGETHER IN KNOXVILLE, TN, AND THEN I MOVED TO TEXAS... DUE TO THE LONG DISTANCE CALLS, HE DOESN'T CALL OFTEN, SO HE SENT THIS TO ME FOR UPLOAD TO KEELYNET....... HE HAS BEEN WORKING WITH THE HENDERSHOT GENERATOR FOR SOME TIME, AND HAS WOUND A BEAUTIFUL PAIR OF BASKET COILS AND HAS BECOME EXPERT AT MAKING THE CAPACITORS CALLED FOR IN THE TEXT. ALAS, THE DEVICE STILL DOES NOT PUT OUT ANY POWER. CHAD DOES THE BEST LOOKING ASSEMBLY WORK I HAVE SEEN, AND IS A VERY GOOD TECHNICIAN. HE UMPED AT THE COILBAK AS AN IDEA, AND IMMEDIATELY TRIED HIS HAND AT THE CIRCUIT. FOLLOWING ARE HIS RESPONCES: ********************************************************** To KeelyNet Jan. 3rd, 1994 RE: Coilbak circuit submitted by Joel McClain As I have experimented with the Coilbak circuit, I have Page 10 obtained no favorable results as yet. I would like to point out two critical factors in the circuit design: 1.) Regardless of where the comparator reference voltage is set, the SCR has been triggered and will not turn off by any subsequent action of the gate voltage from the comparator output. Since the SCR is conducting, the sawtooth ramp will continue to maintain bias on the SCR anode, ensuring that it will conduct the entire ramp from triggering to maximum amplitude. There is no way to inhibit the coil charge cycle at 90 degrees. 2.) Due to the extremely short duration of the sawtooth "low" state, I have not found an SCR that will respond to such a short transient and reset before the next ramp begins. The only exception to this is pulling the sawtooth waveform below ground by using a negative supply in addition to the positive battery supply. This, of course, tends to negate the entire purpose of the circuit since that supply cannot be replenished. This has been my experience to date. I am normally not a skeptic regarding such matters, (I always hope everyone has altruistic intentions) but something seems to be missing or incorrect. Have I missed something? Sincerely, Chad Pryson 3708 Douglas Dam Rd. Kodak, TN 37764 615-933-8025 =========================================================================== Message 4491 DATE/TIME: 01/23/94 01:32 From : WILLIAM ALLEN -- PRIVATE -- -- RECEIVED -- To : JOEL MCCLAIN Subject: CHAD Folder : A, "Public Mail" JOEL, MY FRIEND CHAD PRYSON HAS SENT ME A RESPONSE TO LOAD TO THE NET CONCERNING COILBAK. THIS NOTE IS TO LET YOU KNOW TO GET THE FIRE EXTINGUISHER READY. FLAME ON! HE WOULD APPRECIATE ANY REPLY, PERHAPS ALONG WITH YOUR RESULTS. MESSAGE #4490 IS MY PRELUDE AND HIS LETTER... THANKS. WILLIAM ALLEN P.S.... NO OFFENSE OF COURSE! ALL IN THE INTEREST OF F.E. FOR ALL! =========================================================================== Message 4538 DATE/TIME: 01/24/94 23:16 From : BOB ALDRICH -- RECEIVED -- To : TERRY BASTIAN Subject: (R) efficient batteries Folder : A, "Public Mail" Terry, Page 11 Ok, here's the scoop on this liquid electricity. The man I know who told me is getting older, and so couldn't recall all that I remembered, but he did come up with some more details. He couldn't recall the man's name, but he is known in the midwest for his invention that waters farms, sort of a very high-powered water pistol.. It irrigates a farm with one nozzle... it shoots water half a mile or more! He almost recalle the name, but not quite, but said it rhymes with stag or stap or something.. He said that someone else did some experiments along the same lines, that he copied what this man did, and that this other man disappeared. Whether he left suddenly or mysteriously or just moved away, or was abducted is not known. This man did say that the liquid electricity battery was doubly enclosed (possibly for insulation from heat) and that it was charged for several hours at a very high voltage and it eventually got extremely heavy. If you shook it the electricity sloshed around inside. He had built a small model, cooled by helium (although I thought my friend said nitrogen last time) that, if scaled up, per his calculations to a cubic foot, WOULD CONTAIN ENOUGH ENERGY TO LIGHT NEW YORK CITY FOR A WEEK. Also that this cubic foot of electricity WOULD WEIGH ABOUT TWO TONS. There is another such device, a different researcher, somewhere in Washington or Oregon possibly, who has something similar called the Trinium battery. Don't know if it's exactly the same thing, but if you want I could trace this down also. AND, here is another one. Another type of battery was designed by a fellow named Joe Wallace of Phoenix, Arizona in the mid-fifties. This battery was TWO CUBIC INCHES, yet was comparable to the lead-acid car battery we know. And it would draw higher current. My friend saw one the size of a penny (single cell) that would produce hundreds of amps at 1-1.5 volts! It was SILVER BASED; the electrolyte may have been silver chloride. One terminal was a paste and the other terminal was a solid terminal. There may be a way to trace this fellow down. However, some of the technology may be defense related, as Amphenol allowed him to demonstrate his battery to them (how nice of them) but they didn't want to buy his design, as they had a similar design which didn't work as well but was adequate for their use, which was used in the detonation of the Atomic Bomb! All for now! Bob --------------------------------------------------------------------------- KeelyNet (214) 324-3501 is a FREE Alternative Sciences BBS Your file contributions and financial support are much appreciated! --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Page 12